Věda kafemlejnkem drcená

18. 06. 2009 | 13:05
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Investice do lidských zdrojů, vzdělávání a podpora rozvoje vědění prostřednictvím pěstování výzkumu a vývoje vytváří zdroje rozvoje moderní společnosti podobně, jako tyto zdroje v minulých obdobích závisely na surovinách, financích či masovém nasazení málo kvalifikovaných pracovníků. Výrazná podpora přístupu ke vzdělání a rozvoji vědy může zejména v dobách hospodářských těžkostí představovat sazenici, ze které vyrůstá pevný kmen, z nějž raší výhonky nových příležitostí uplatnění a rostou na něm plody zlepšování kvality života ve společnosti. Rozvoj vědy jako systému lidského poznání není ovšem jen katalyzátorem ekonomické prosperity, ale je i důležitou složkou kultury společnosti. Jeho nositeli jsou osobnosti vynikající svými tvůrčími schopnostmi, které vynakládají nikoli k vytváření osobního blahobytu, ale v prvé řadě k objevování nových znalostí o člověku a světě, které se prostřednictvím volně dostupných publikací dostávají bez dalších omezení nejširší veřejnosti, která má možnost těchto poznatků volně užívat ke komerčním i nekomerčním účelům.

Věda, instituce, na kterých jsou její poznatky vytvářeny, i vědci, kteří v těchto institucích pracují, jsou však momentálně vystaveny útoku, který pod pláštíkem podpory vědecké excelence podmínky rozvoje vědění na tuzemských institucích výrazně poškodí a jejich zdroje vytuneluje. Oslavovaná reforma výzkumu a vývoje a Radou vlády pro výzkum a vývoj prosazovaná metodika hodnocení výzkumných výsledků umrtvuje prostředí akademických institucí (vysokých škol, ústavů Akademie věd, apod.) podporujících růst lidského poznání v různorodé paletě pěstovaných vědních oborů redukcí vědy na jediný numerický parametr.

Primitivní redukcionismus

Tento jediný parametr má v duchu primitivního redukcionismu určovat přežití nebo likvidaci existujících akademických institucí. Představa o společné jednotné povaze hodnocených disciplin je přitom z podstaty věci chybná a běžně dostupnými odbornými studiemi dostatečně přesvědčivě vyvrácená. Její zastánci z Rady vlády pro výzkum a vývoj a její komise pro hodnocení výsledků se z pozice úzké perspektivy vlastních vědních oborů této představy drží podobně s podobnou úporností, jako se naivní mechanisté pokoušeli vysvětlovat psychologii, filozofii nebo biologii srážkami kulečníkových koulí. Chyba této redukce není odstranitelná jemnějším vyladěním jednotlivých parametrů (budeme vysvětlovat filosofii nikoli kulečníkovými koulemi, ale interakcemi superstrun), systém je fundamentálně chybně koncipován. Jeho výchozí myšlenka se zpočátku může zdát jako zajímavá a potenciálně schůdná (a problémy jejího nasazení jsou ryze technické, prostě koulí je mnoho a my zatím nemáme dostatečně výkonný počítač), ze zahraničních zkušeností je však naprosto zřejmé, že analýza možné realizace takového systému velmi rychle ukážou fundamentální a neschůdná úskalí. V důsledku čehož se cestou, jaká se nastoupila u nás, ve světě nevydali nikde (ve Velké Británii např. vedly předběžné výsledky analýzy kvality bibliometrických dat k rozhodnutí oznámenému v těchto dnech, že proces peer review nebude ani v oblasti tzv. tvrdých věd nahrazen mechanickým ukazatelem na bázi citací, viz např. zprávu z Times Higher Education z 18. 6., resp. prezentaci zástupce HEFCE na konferenci zmiňované v tomto článku).

Hodnocení výsledků výzkumných institucí založené na mechanickém sbírání bodů udílených za různorodé výsledky nesrovnatelné nejen kvalitativně, tedy typem svého přínosu k lidskému vědění, ale ani kvantitativně úsilím a potřebnou mírou vědecké poctivosti k jejich získání, podporuje chování pracovníků akademických institucí, které je svou povahou patologické. Navzdory opačně znějícím proklamacím je kvalita vytěsňována kvantitou. Jeden špičkový, vysoce odborně oponovaný výsledek znamenající skutečný pokrok ve vědě je snadno nahrazen spoustou drobných a samostatně nepříliš zajímavých výsledků, které nemusejí podléhat žádnému nebo alespoň nikoli srovnatelnému měřítku originality nebo přínosu, nemluvě o pseudovýsledcích produkovaných jen proto, že za ně „metodika hodnocení“ udílí body. Pokud by se tímto způsobem hodnotila sportovní odvětví, nedostala by se nikdy například koulařka s vrhem daleko přes dvacet metrů na stupně vítězů, pokud by její výkon mohlo zastínit několik desítek šťouchů tágem přes celou délku kulečníku. Problematické je i samo mezioborové porovnávání – srovnával by někdo v jednom žebříčku uměleckou gymnastku se sprinterem na sto metrů? A snažil by se je stavět proti sobě způsobem, kterým jsou proti sobě dnes stavěny vysoké školy a ústavy Akademie věd?

Takto koncipované hodnocení je vysoce asociální. Špatně koncipovaný mechanický systém hodnocení totiž navíc ztotožňuje s mechanickým rozdělováním financí na provoz výzkumných institucí. V žádné jiné netržní oblasti není s vybudovanými institucemi zacházeno ve stylu živelně fungující džungle, bez jakékoli odpovědnosti za jejich osud a s naprostou lhostejností k tomu, co se s nashromážděným lidským kapitálem stane. Nikoho nenapadne konstruovat pravidla rozpočtového určení daní tak, že by obce byly závislé pouze na vyprodukovaných daních a při jejich výpadku by je okamžitě polykal exekutor. Mají své základní prostředky na provoz, které jim umožňují fungovat. U vědeckých institucí je nepochybné, že potřebují základní provozní financování dřív, než do nich vkročí první vědec. Radou vlády pro výzkum a vývoj prosazený systém se však tváří, jako by tomu tak nebylo.

Chybějící vize institucí pěstujících vědu

Reforma výzkumu a vývoje nevytváří vizi systému vědeckých institucí a jejich vzájemných vazeb. Naoko se tváří, že podporuje excelenci a špičkové instituce. Vědu ovšem vytváří nejen několik špičkových výzkumníků, ale také existence soustavy činností a institucí zajišťujících pokračování tradice, tedy předávání znalostí a pracovních postupů mezi generacemi výzkumníků. Ve vynikajících světových institucích se žáci učí od mistrů svých disciplin. Nové ideje a převratné koncepce jsou často výsledkem kvasu meziinstitucionální mobility a možností pro ty nejlepší přecházet z institucí průměrných na špičkové. Izolované ostrůvky excelence by se bez prostředí, které jim dodává novou krev, rychle vyčerpaly a zhynuly. Je to podobné jako ve sportu, kdy izolované soustředění se na několik pečlivě vybraných a od zbytku vrstevníků izolovaných jednotlivců určených na selektivní trénink vytváří patologickou strukturu ve srovnání se zdravějším a hlavně stabilnějším stavem, kdy se talenty objevují mezi spontánně sportující mládeží a své první zkušenosti získávají na obecních nebo okresních přeborech, nikoli hned na olympiádě. Mechanický způsob hodnocení a finanční podpory tvorbu center excelence nijak nepodporuje, přestože důraz na kvalitu a mezinárodní srovnání je v posuzování vědu podstatný. Instituce jsou hodnoceny svým minulým výkonem, nikoli potenciálem pro výsledky v budoucnu. Nové instituce bez historie minulých výkonů prakticky vzniknout nemohou, pro mobilitu a agregaci špičkových vědců neposkytuje tuzemský systém žádné podněty. Opět přestože v zahraničních systémech tyto prvky obsaženy jsou a k poučení tedy mohlo dojít.

Reforma obsahuje místo vize systému institucí vytvářejících nové poznatky a vychovávajících nové generace badatelů pouze mechanismus distribuce veřejných finančních prostředků tam, kde se lépe přizpůsobí parametrům hodnotící metodiky. Tento způsob je s ohledem na prokazatelnou věcnou chybnost hodnotícího nástroje zaveden zcela nezodpovědně a fakticky slouží v prvé řadě jako nástroj, kterým si zájmové skupiny zajišťují lepší pozici u zdroje financování. Politická odpovědnost je schována za zdánlivou objektivitu, všemocnou „metodiku“. Zvolený způsob hodnocení navíc podporu excelence vědomě vyměňuje za slevenky průmyslu a skrytou veřejnou podporu tržním subjektům. Místo podpory spolupráce průmyslu s centry vytvářejícími nové poznatky ve výzkumu nebo umožňujícími sledování a přebírání poznatků z předních linií světového výzkumu do domácího aplikovaného prostředí motivuje soukromé subjekty k získávání dotací na činnosti, které úzce souvisí s jejich postavením na trhu a konkurenčním bojem. Systém přímo aplikačně zaměřené podpory tedy snižuje průhlednost hospodářské soutěže. Upozaďování důležitosti podpory základního výzkumu povede k tomu, že se zhorší podmínky výchovy mladých výzkumníků a aplikovaná sféra začne brzy trpět nedostatkem pracovníků vzdělaných ve výzkumu tak, aby mohli být skutečným přínosem.

Etická diskvalifikace proponentů „reformy“

Radou vlády zavedený systém hodnocení výzkumu odborně diskvalifikuje vědce, kteří se na jeho vytváření podíleli a kteří mohou sice být dobří ve svých vědních disciplinách, nicméně se, na bázi ryzího amatérismu, naivního užití bibliometrie a po matematické a statistické stránce diletantského zpracování dat, propůjčili k práci, ve které si nemohou nebýt vědomi mezí svých odborných kompetencí. Je to prohřešek proti obecným etickým zásadám vědce, které u odborníků působících v prostředí akademického výzkumu musí přicházet jako podmínka nutná ještě před tím, než se vykazují úzce odbornými výsledky ve vlastních disciplinách. O naprosto neprominutelný etický prohřešek se jedná tam, kde byla tato asistence na odborně nekvalitním díle politiky odměněna místy ve vedení stávajících nebo připravovaných agentur poskytujících financování výzkumu – a to i v případě, že by se tak bylo bývalo stalo korektním způsobem na základě většinového názoru odpovědných kolektivních orgánů bez manipulace dozírajícím politikem.

Etický marasmus prostředí kolem Rady vlády pro výzkum a vývoj je také ilustrován nekonstruktivním a obsahově mimoběžným „vypořádávání“ připomínek k metodice hodnocení výzkumu. Věcné připomínky a výhrady jsou oficiálně zamítány, ze způsobu stanovení dalšího postupu práce v Komisi pro hodnocení i Radě vlády pro výzkum a vývoj je přitom zřejmé, že vady zvoleného postupu jsou neobhajitelné a musí být ve výrazné míře korigovány. Pro zastánce nikým oficiálně nevyhlášené destrukce jedné části výzkumných institucí posloužilo hodnocení výsledků výzkumu a vývoje jako skalpel k podříznutí málo se bránící oběti, který bude po použití celý zkrvavený vyhozen a nahrazen čistějším. Neomluvitelný v této souvislosti je i postoj šéfů institucí ze systému dočasně profitujících, kteří změny ve financování zavedené Radou vlády pro výzkum a vývoj podpoří jen proto, že jejich institucím momentálně přináší víc peněz, i když věcné chyby zvoleného přístupu jsou jim známy – dobré jméno takových akademických institucí nebo dobré jméno (vědeckých) osobností v jejich čele je takovým chováním poškozeno v míře řádově vyšší, než kolik činí dočasný zisk z takové konformity. Těžko se také lze vyhnout obecnější otázce: Je-li vědec v čele své instituce ochoten si zavřít oči před evidentními chybami metodiky hodnocení jen proto, že jeho instituce dostane víc financí, dá se mu věřit, že nebude stejně slepý k údajům, které by vyvrátily výsledky, se kterými přichází ve svém článku?

Kudy k nápravě?

Při formulování vědní politiky a zavádění souvisejících právních norem musí stát dospět k jasnému politickému rozhodnutí, jaké vědní instituce, obory bádání a souhru a vzájemné působení mezi těmito institucemi chce podporovat. Tato struktura musí být institucionálně zajištěna tak, aby zápas o lepší finanční zabezpečení nedegeneroval v zápas o pouhé přežití těchto institucí. Teprve s jistou bazickou úrovní na výkonech nezávislé institucionální dotace lze soutěžit o nadstandardní prostředky. Nechce-li stát podporovat celou škálu existujících institucí, měl by přistoupit k akreditaci podle specifikovaných podmínek a jasně instituce rozdělit na ty, kterým je poskytnuta perspektiva, a ty, které jsou určeny na zrušení. Soutěž o mezi výzkumnými institucemi musí být oborově rozdělena, ve vnitrooborovém vymezení nic nebrání užívat i kvantitativní kritéria, která vycházejí ze srovnání se světovou úrovní vědy v daném oboru. Je ale třeba respektovat dramaticky se lišící charakter „aplikačních“ výstupů v některých disciplinách i jejich zcela rozdílnou vazbu na jazykové prostředí.

Aplikační výzkum a spolupráci akademických výzkumných institucí s průmyslem je žádoucí podpořit pobídkami ke spolupráci průmyslu s výzkumem. Dominantní místo zde nemohou mít přímé dotace, ale nejvýše daňové úlevy, které mohou podpořit účelové dotace výzkumným institucím směřované na spolupráci s průmyslem. Takový přístup může být finančně neutrální, pokud se o předpokládané daňové úlevy sníží finance na aplikovaný výzkum, případně se podpoří výzkum spojený přímo se vzděláváním.

Samuel Zajíček a Jiří Zlatuška
Zkrácená verze vyšla 28. 6. v Respektu č. 27.

Komentáře

Aktuálně.cz má zájem poskytovat prostor jen pro korektní a slušně vedenou debatu. Tím, že zde publikujete svůj příspěvek, se zároveň zavazujete dodržovat Kodex diskutujících. Pokud Váš text obsahuje hrubé urážky, vulgarismy, spamy, hanlivá komolení jmen, vzbuzuje podezření z porušení zákona, je celý napsán velkými písmeny či jinak odporuje zdejším pravidlům, vystavujete se riziku, že jej editor smaže.
Přejeme Vám zajímavou a inspirativní výměnu názorů.
Libor Stejskal, editor blogů (blogy@aktualne.cz)

disliked favored napsal(a):

Topolánek právě oznamuje vznik NÁRODNÍ FRONTY II.

ODS se snaží pohltit neziskové organizace, federace, zájmová sdružení atd.

Chraň nás pánbůh.

Rok 1948 je zpět. Totalita tentokrát přichází zprava.

Věda už bude jen služka vedoucí síly lidstva - ODS.
18. 06. 2009 | 13:40

disliked favored napsal(a):

Tzv. "malým subjektům" bude dána nabídka, která se slovy Topolánka "nedá odmítnout".

Je jasné, že kdo nebude souhlasit, bude mít v budoucnu krušný život.

Organizace závislé na státních financích si pasivitou podepíšou rozsudek.

Co myslíte, pane Zlatuško, dostanou tuto nabídku i vedoucí vědeckých ústavů a AV?
18. 06. 2009 | 13:48

Rasmus napsal(a):

Stravil jsem rok v Dansku - studijne a pracovne. Vlada tam podporuje jak university, tak vedu a vzdelavani vseobecne.

Vladne tam tamni socialisticka strana a kdyz jsem se ptal, kde a jak na to berou penize, tak odpovidali.

Vybirame vysoke dane (41%), tyto dane prerozdelujeme. Vyzaduje se ale na druhe strane prisna disciplina a poradek. Jakmile nekdo minimalne podvadi,fixluje nebo se staci cokoliv obejit, je tvrde potrestan.

To je myslim zasadni rozdil mezi ČR a DK. Byt prisni,disciplinovani a dodrzovat řád - to se v ČR dnes nenosí.Jak bychom to mohli chtit po obcanech, kdyz to nedelaji ani ti nejvyssi cesti politici. Tam spatruji primarni problem.
18. 06. 2009 | 14:06

julča napsal(a):

POvažuji za důležitý tenhle Váš odstavec:

"Neomluvitelný v této souvislosti je i postoj šéfů institucí ze systému dočasně profitujících, kteří změny ve financování zavedené Radou vlády pro výzkum a vývoj podpoří jen proto, že jejich institucím momentálně přináší víc peněz, i když věcné chyby zvoleného přístupu jsou jim známy – dobré jméno takových akademických institucí nebo dobré jméno (vědeckých) osobností v jejich čele je takovým chováním poškozeno v míře řádově vyšší, než kolik činí dočasný zisk z takové konformity. Těžko se také lze vyhnout obecnější otázce: Je-li vědec v čele své instituce ochoten si zavřít oči před evidentními chybami metodiky hodnocení jen proto, že jeho instituce dostane víc financí, dá se mu věřit, že nebude stejně slepý k údajům, které by vyvrátily výsledky, se kterými přichází ve svém článku?"

A chci se zeptat - co uděláte s těmi šéfy? Oni se změní jako mávnutím proutku, až se podaří prosadit ta nová, lepší pravidla? nejsou spíše produktem stejného hluboce usazeného systému jako ta perverzní pravidla ustavená Radou vlády.
Tahleta ohnutá připosranost je přece komplementární k zájmům těch, kteří skutečně na situaci profitují. A znám pracoviště, kde takový šéf má sobě podobné následovníky, přece by se neohrozil nějakým hadem na prsou, chytřejším a schopnějším než je on sám.
18. 06. 2009 | 14:46

Praktický demagog napsal(a):

Krátké, výstižné. Děkuji.
18. 06. 2009 | 15:17

Neopřemyslovec napsal(a):

Investice do Alternativní medicíny (minimálně 5% z AV) se musí stát nezbytným rozhodnutím. Pro většinu národa je nepředstavitelné, že by v kritické chvíli, kdy věda selháva, nevyužili často zázračnou Alternativní medicínu. Proto se zdrojům plynoucí do černé díry AV, musí odebrat 5% z miliardového rozhazování akademikům.
Akademie věd jsou v zásadě zločinecké organizace, a to neříkám jen tak neuváženě. Pokud říkám zločinecké organizace, tak to nemyslím jako pomluvu, nýbrž jako fakt. Tam nejde o vědu, nýbrž jde o to, že tam lidi jsou naprosto nekompetentní, skrz naskrz zkorumpovaní. Já jsem pracoval v AV, já znám rozměry korupce. Jde tam jen o to, jak zmanipulovat projekty tak, abych se z toho obohatil já a kamarádi, ruka ruku myje, peníze pro kamarádíčky, ten systém je zkorumpovaný od shora až dolů. Akademie věd se proměnila v příšernou změť slabochů, neumějí nic udělat sami, umějí jenom kozumovat, žijou ve velkých domech, jezdějí ve velkých autech a sami jsou velcí a tlustí. Neumějí prostě přestat žít nad svoje poměry. Spotřebovávají příliš mnoho jídla, energie a prostoru. Nevědí, jak se žije skromně. Nyní party skončila a utahovat si opasky bude bolet. Mimo je stále se rozrůstající vrstva naprostých chudáků, což tady ještě nikdy nebylo. Je to hrůza. Velcí žravý akademici chtějí zničit malé, jak už se to v historii opakovaně stává. Jeden z trendů, který příjde proti nim, nazýváme "utnout jim hlavy". K tomu určitě dojde. Takže má se za to, že dojde k opravdovému povstání? Nepochybně. Akademici nemají ani potuchy, co znamená být úplně chudý a žít na ulici. Když lidi připravíte o všechno a už nemají co ztratit, jsou schopni čehokoliv.
18. 06. 2009 | 15:18

Al Jouda napsal(a):

Souhlasím s tím, že je třeba vybrat vědecké disciplíny a pouze ty podporovat. Vybral bych výzkum směřující k využití sluneční a geotermální energie - a šmytec!
18. 06. 2009 | 15:51

josef napsal(a):

To Neopřemyslovec,
člověče, čím jste se tak ztřískal?
18. 06. 2009 | 16:09

jj napsal(a):

pro neopřemyslovce:
a co alchymie, na tu jste zapomněl_
18. 06. 2009 | 16:49

Taoiseach napsal(a):

Al Jouda:

Doufám, že jste to nemyslel vážně.

Aby bylo jasno, o čem vůbec mluvíme: vědecké disciplíny (a jejich výuka na VŠ) je jedna věc, základní výzkum je druhá věc a aplikovaný výzkum je třetí věc. Bez základního výzkumu nemůžeme mít kvalitní výuku ani kvalitní aplikovaný výzkum.

A myslíte to vážně, že by měl být "šmytec" s výzkumem např. v oborech:
- lékařství
- farmacie
- biochemie
- genetika
- pedagogika
- fyzika částic
- fyzika plasmatu
- jaderná fyzika
- nové materiály
- atd. atd.??

Aby předešel moudrým radám starců týkajícím se toho, že malá země nemůže dělat všechno, předesílám, že všechno se musí dělat (a z velké části už dělá) v mezinárodní spolupráci.

Neopřemyslovec:

Šlehněte si nějakou tu alternativní meducínu, když tak pomáhá...
18. 06. 2009 | 17:28

Samuel Zajíček napsal(a):

Al Jouda: Vím, že to může znít skandálně, ale není skandálnější stav, kdy sice deklarujete, že podporujete třeba ekonomická zkoumání, ale pak fakticky nastavíte pravidla tak, že tato zhynou na úbytě? Nebylo by vlastně lepší, aby se rovnou řeklo, že ekonomové stejně způsobili krizi (dělám si legraci) a že je tedy stát nebude podporovat? Nebylo by to i vůči nim poctivější?
Minimálně by pak mohla začít vážně míněná veřejná debata a za toto rozhodnutí by někdo nesl jasnou politickou zodpovědnost.

julca: Vzhledem k tomu, že tito "šéfové" jsou obvykle volení, je možné je, pokud nezmění svůj postoj, prostě znovu nevolit. A do doby voleb přirozeně přemlouvat, argumentovat. Vím, že se Vám to možná zdá málo, ale co už v demokracii dělat, buďme rádi aspoň za to.
18. 06. 2009 | 21:20

Al Jouda napsal(a):

To Taoiseach :
Samozřejmě, že jsem to střelil od boku. Pokládám ale tyto dva směry za takové tahouny, které stejně budou ke svému úspěchu potřebovat souběžný výzkum v oborech, které jste uvedl.
To Samuel :
Ekonomové tu krizi nezpůsobili, vinni jsou ti, co kupčí s penězi v globálním měřítku a přitom kradou ve velkém.
19. 06. 2009 | 00:08

Z.T. napsal(a):

Problémy české vědy:

1) Neustálá nejistota, co bude => vědci tráví neúměrně mnoho času tomu, že vymýšlejí, jak "přežít" místo toho, aby dělali vědu.

2) Současný systém hodnocení vědy je skutečně špatný, protože vede k tomu, že se řada podprůměrných vědeckých týmů skvěle živí tím, že produkují mizerné výstupy, za které však sbírají spoustu bodů v hodnocení a vypadají špičkově.

3) Místo toho, aby se dalo na vědu a vzdělání více peněz, které by se rozdělovaly tak, jak je na západ od nás zvykem, se skupina rádobyodborníků věnuje vymyšlení metodiky, která napáchá více škody než užitku. Prof. Zlatuška má bohužel naprostou pravdu.
19. 06. 2009 | 06:56

David Kalhous napsal(a):

Nezbyva, nez souhlasit s autory prispevku. Otazkou je, zda bude mit i prakticky dopad, nebo zustane jen chytrym a dobre napsanym placnutim do vody.
19. 06. 2009 | 10:36

Alenka napsal(a):

A co na to instituce? Akademie věd, Česká konference rektorů, Rada vysokých škol, Učená společnost? Není nejvyšší čas, aby se distancovaly jak od konkrétních politik, tak od zcela konkrétních osob?
19. 06. 2009 | 19:37

Vaclav Horejsi napsal(a):

Alenka:

AV a Ucena spolecnost se od toho ostre distancovaly.
Predstavitele vysokych skol nic nerikaji a jejich zastupci v RVV to vlastne spiskali...
Nekteri predstavitele VS si mysli, ze na teto veci vydelaji na ukor AV.
Velmi kratkozrake - prodela na tom cela ceska veda...
..
19. 06. 2009 | 21:35

Masopust napsal(a):

Až na ty poslední dva odstavce to lze číst, ale pak!? "Stát by měl rozdělit a rozhodnout, koho podporovat..." Stát nic nerozdělí a nic přece nerozhodne, vždycky jenom lidé, kteří ho budou v nějaké komisi zastupovat, a to tedy - chraň nás přírodo před takovou komisí a zvlášť jestli v ní budou takoví, jako Zlatuška.
19. 06. 2009 | 22:35

Samuel Zajíček napsal(a):

Alenka: Dynamika akademicke pudy je holt trochu jina, nez dynamika malych firem nebo jednotlivcu. Prof. Horejsi pise, ze AV a ČUS se distancovaly. Nedodava, ze se poradne distancovaly az cca pred mesicem, kdyz vysledky Metodiky jsou znamy nekdy od unora a Metodika jako takova uz je na stole jeste mnohem dele.
Domnivam se, ze podobne se nakonec budou distancovat i minimalne jednotlive VS, kdyz uz ne RVS a CKR (ale RVS nyni, pokud vim, prijala usnaseni ve smyslu, ze nesouhlasi s tim, jak RVV vyporadala jeji pripominky, a vyzvala jejiho predsedu - premiera Fischera -, aby jednal; nespokojenost tedy roste. Naopak od CKR se zrejme nic moc cekat neda: zvolili si, zrejme hlasy soukromych VS, do cela prof. Fialu, ktery v RVV pusobi). Jen to bude nejakou dobu trvat, nez si krom jednotlivcu situaci uvedomi i rektoraty. Doufejme, ze nebude pozde.

Zvlaste u UK a CVUT je pritom uvaha jednoducha: Pokud by se vyslysel pozadavek Hospodarske komory a AV se roztrhala a priradila k VS, prichazeji v uvahu v podstate pouze CVUT a UK, protoze vetsina ustavu AV je v Praze (minoritne pak JCU a MU, VSCHT, mozna VSB nebo OU v Ostrave). I kdyby se tak stalo ihned a Metodika prevedla minule vysledky jednotlivych ustavu pod nove poskytovatele, provoz ustavu se nijak nezmeni a tedy s kazdym ustavem by vyse zminene univerzity ziskaly vyrazne ztratove podniky (navic by zrejme zanikla rozpoctova kapitola pro AV, takze ztratovost by se jeste prohloubila).
Jelikoz neni myslitelne, aby ustavy najednou zacaly byt prosperujicimi (ani dvojnasobny publikacni vykon by to nezaridil, viz debata pod blogem prof. Horejsiho), dane univerzity nebudou moci nez bud se bit za to same, za co by stalo za to bit se jiz nyni spolecne s AV, nebo proste dane ustavy zavrit, vedce propustit a domy prodat.
At se na to divame jak chceme, vysledkem necinnosti bude efektivni uzavreni ustavu Akademie, ktere ale, pokud se to stane az po naplneni vyse uvedeneho scenare, hrube poskodi hlavne CVUT a UK - jak financne, tak i hlavne moralne. Muzeme si predstavit titulky: "UK zavira ustav prof. Holeho!".

Zcela zvraceny je v tomto smyslu rozhovor s prof. Zrzavym v tomto Respektu, kde prof. Zrzavy argumentuje ve stylu "Na AV jsou opravdove spicky, na VS lide nevykonni, proto AV pridruzme k VS, protoze tim, ze jsou mimo system vzdelavani, snizuji kvalitu vysokych skol". Nepodcenuji inteligenci prof. Zrzaveho, proto se ptam, kam miri. Mozna je neco na paranoidnich zvestech, ze nektere VS chteji hlavne pustit Praze zilou, at to stoji, co to stoji.
Ale mozna jenom nevi, ze zapojeni do doktorskych programu by AV nepomohlo (a tezko si predstavit, ze by ony deklarovane "spicky" provozovaly misto vedy normalni vysokou skolu - na to nejsou ani cas, ani prostory; VS praskaji ve svech uz nyni), protoze na doktorandy maji instituce jen naprosto bezvyznamne dotace, protoze penize jimi jen ucetne protecou primo do rukou studentu ve forme doktorskych stipendii.
Masopust: Nevadi Vam, ze stat jiz nyni skrze Akreditacni komisi rozhoduje, komu prispeje na studenty a komu ne? Vy si automaticky predstavujete neco spatneho, ale akreditace nejsou od prirody takove. Nekdo musi rozhodnout, zda chce prispivat i na treba institut alternativni mediciny nebo podporovat a uznat magisterske studium astrologie. Kdyby to nerozhodoval nikdo, profitovali by predevsim sarlatani.

V kazdem pripade ale je mozne souhlasit s tim, ze by bylo vhodne a jedine spravne, aby v takovych komisich vetsinove sedeli z velke casti zahranicni odbornici: cesky rybnicek je maly a zatuchly.
20. 06. 2009 | 01:59

F. Adamec napsal(a):

Veda bez praxe z prirody, je jako Klaus bez komunistu, socialnich a jinych demokratu. Katedrovi vedci, sberaci titulu, hlasujte o prirodnich zakonech, komunista Fischer vam na to udela statistiku.

Manzelka prijela z Brna. Okopala zeleninu. Konecne prselo celou noc. Vcera jsem nakul kosu a ted pujdu kosit travu ve vinohrade, bez herbicidu, chemie a umelych hnoviv.
20. 06. 2009 | 07:05

jirizlatuska napsal(a):

Alenka: S. Zajicek uvadi usneseni predsednictva Rady vysokych skol. Vec se ma tek, ze na zasedani predsednictva Rady vysokych skol konanem 18.6. (kratce pred tim, nez jsme zverejnili tento blog) bylo prijato nasledujicici usneseni:

"Předsednictvo Rady vysokých škol
- zásadně nesouhlasí se způsobem vypořádání připomínek k Metodice hodnocení výsledků výzkumu a vývoje v roce 2009,
- vyzývá předsedu Rady pro výzkum a vývoj k přijetí neprodlených kroků k nápravě stavu tak, aby se předešlo škodám, nejen ekonomickým, v oblasti výzkumu a vývoje v České republice,
- PRVŠ vzalo na vědomí informaci o projednání tohoto bodu na 244. zasedání RVV a pokládá za významnou změnu přístupu RVV v této věci avizovanou v bodech 5 a 6 usnesení k bodu B5 z 244. zasedání RVV,
- PRVŠ pověřuje komisi pro vědu a místopředsedu Rady (doc. Kebo), aby připravila za RVŠ ucelenou představu o způsobu hodnocení výsledků VaV a o rozdělení institucionální podpory na VaV mezi jednotlivé poskytovatele. Pro zajištění kvality uvedeného materiálu pověřuje:
a) zpracováním základního vstupního materiálu v termínu do 7. září (prof. Barvík)
b) přípravou semináře k uvedené problematice v termínu zářijového zasedání PRVŠ (doc. Kebo)
c) zpracováním závěrů a následné odeslání ucelené koncepční představy o hodnocení VaV a rozdělování institucionální podpory v termínu do 30. září (prof. Barvík, doc. Kebo, prof. Haasz)"

Je v nem jista mira nesouhlasu obsazena, byt se vaze konkretne k textu vyporadani pripominek k metodice hodnoceni (posledni sloupec v dokumentu http://www.fi.muni.cz/~zlat...].

Text prijateho usneseni byl prijat jako prtinavrh modifikujici navrh usneseni , ktery jsem pRVS predlozil nekolik dni pred zasedanim v nasledujicim neprijatem zneni:

"Předsednictvo Rady vysokých škol
- považuje za pobuřující a nepřijatelný způsob vypořádání připomínek k Metodice hodnocení výsledků výzkumu a vývoje v roce 2009,
- konstatuje, že zvolený postup k zapracování připomínek Radu pro výzkum a vývoj jako odborný a poradní orgán vlády ČR podle § 35 zákona č. 130/2002 Sb. věcně diskredituje,
- upozorňuje na skutečnost, že principiálně vadný přístup k hodnocení výzkumných institucí vzájemně nesrovnatelných jedním číselným parametrem bez náležitého věcného odůvodnění neposkytuje podklad, na základě kterého by mohli političtí činitelé odpovědně konat a rozhodovat v rámci pravomocí a odpovědnosti plynoucí z jejich mandátu,
- vyzývá předsedu vlády České republiky k přijetí neprodlených kroků k nápravě stavu tak, aby se předešlo škodám, nejen ekonomickým, v oblasti výzkumu a vývoje v České republice."

Pro verzi prijatou predsednictvem jsem jako jeden z nekolika mala nehlasoval (zdrzel jsem se), protoze posun, ktery vuci puvodnimi navrhu obsahuje, na cil, ktery si to zaslouzi, miri jen castecne -- pres "zasadni nesouhlas" s postupem RVV se obraci na RVV, nikoli na organ, ktery je za ni odpovedny (nic na tom nemeni, ze predseda vlady je personalne totozny s predsedou RVV, predseda vlady ma ustavni odpovednost ranku, ktery si soucasna krize zpusobena Radou vlady pro vyzkum a vyvoj vyzaduje);
prijaty text take svym ukolovanim komise RVS pristoupil na klamnou alibistickou hru, kterou RVV vuci oponentum zvolila, tj. na vyzvu, ze oponenti postupu RVV maji behem nesmyslne kratke doby a bez potrebneho institucionalniho i materialniho zabezpeceni, kterym na rozdil od nich RVV pro tento ucel disponuje, prijit s ucelenou koncepci, jak rozdelovani penez mezi resorty delat;
problem nesmyslne "metodiky" take neni jen v rozdelovani penez mezi resorty, protoze tuto metodiku pouziva urovni mnohem mensich organizacnich nebo personalnich jednotek napr. system ESOP (http://www.ecba.cz/z3k3/ESO...) vyuzivany ke generovani podkkladu pro hodnoceni prihlasek do programu EU, v dusledku formulaci v zakone ho prebiraji i nektere vysoke skoly jako pdoklad pro sva interni hodnoceni, atd., atd. (je to nicmene ekonomicka i neekonomicka skoda, kterou tento pristup RVV generuje - povazme jen, kolik lidi teto veci venuje svuj cas a kapacitu, povazme, jak to prispiva k pokriveni vnitrnich podminek tam, kde neni vychozi institucionalni predstava dostatecne dobra sama o sobe).

(...)
20. 06. 2009 | 08:52

jirizlatuska napsal(a):

Sama zasadni kritika uvedena v uvodu prijateho usneseni by za normalni situace mela byt postacujici, zde se ovsem hraje ponekud cinknutymi kartami - RVV silove prosazuje reseni, ktere by vecne bylo neobhajitelne, pouziva k tomu metodiku jako technicky nastroj, ktery z nicj jakoby snimal odpovednost za konkretni dusledky toho, pri konstrukci svych kroku navic RVV pouziva nekorektni postupy - kdokoli si procte vyporadani pripominek ze strany RVV vidi, ze kdyz RVV usty sveho sekretar zduvodnuje legitimnost dodrzenim vsech potrebnych formalnich procesu meziresortniho pripomoinkoveho rizeni, zni to asi stejne, jako kdyz KLDR bude trvat na tom, ze neni diktaturou, protoze ma prezidenta, ktery byl zvolen ve volbach stejne, jako byl ve volbach zvolen napriklad prezident americky.

Osobni odpovednost clenu RVV na soucasnem stavu je ovsem zcela jasne nepopiratelna a dokresluje ji i fakt, ze nikde v procesu nezaznelo separatni votum, kterym by se aspon jednotlivci od uplatnenych kroku distancovali. Nezdaji se mi v teto situaci prijatelne ani argumenty o tom, ze vlastne uz na clenech te soucasne RVV tak moc nesejde, protoze od pristiho roku bude stejne podle novely zakona 130 jmenovana RVV nova. Osobni odpovednost stavajicich clenu RVV nebo clenu Komise pro hodnoceni vysledku nebude ani jejich odchodem z techto organu umensena. Chyby doposud praktikovaneho systemu byly ve fatalnim nedostatku transparentnosti procesu (napriklad procesu hodnoceni VZ, na ktery pred casem doplatili prazsti prirodovedci [s omluvou "prirodovedci" ze zdejsich diskusi, pokud by chtel mit nazor jiny], ale nejen oni), zatimco vady dnes zavedeneho systemu jsou mnohem principialnejsi a zadne vylepsovani jim nepomuze.
20. 06. 2009 | 08:53

Pavel Krajtl napsal(a):

Co čekat, když se mafiáni začali z politiky rozlézat do vědy. Drzé čelo...
20. 06. 2009 | 22:53

jirizlatuska napsal(a):

Ještě drobné faktické doplnění:

Předběžné výsledky analýzy, kterou ve Velké Británii dělali stran možností použít analýzu citací pro posuzování kvality výzkumné práce, je k dispozici na adrese http://www.hefce.ac.uk/pubs... - RVV ani její komise pro hodnocení výsledků výzkumu (předseda Blažka, autor použitých křivek a způsobu práce s daty zřejně v prvé řadě Gaš) podobné analýzy nedělali a samozřejmě ani nezveřejňovali (všichni tuzemští "odborníci" znají možnosti užití bibliometrie lépe, než přihlouplí Britové, kteří si nejprve možnosti musí analyzovat).

Na konferenci na King's College v Londýně 15. června (viz http://www.kcl.ac.uk/iss/re...) zaznělo vcelku oficiálně, že na základě těchto výsledků HEFCE od možnosti nahradit peer review metrikami na bázi citací ustupuje.

Rosenbergovo vystoupení na této konferenci obsahuje shrnutí problematických zjisštění dosavadní analýzy:

"Bibliometrické metody nejsou dostatečně zralé, aby mohly být užívány v podobě formulek nebo aby mohly nahradit expertní posouzení.
Existuje značná možnost využití bibliometrie jako podkladu pro expertní posuzování.
Má smysl se soustředit jen na vybrané práce, nikoli se snažit zahrnout "všechny" články.
Další práce je třeba na rozpracování způsobu srovnání a na indikátorech.
Robustnost a pokrytí se liší podle zvolené disciplíny - zůstává otázkou, ve kterých disciplínách bibliometrii užívat."
[Kdyby si v Británii když ne celou RVV, tak aspoň Blažku, Gaše nebo Zrzavého, mohli mít po problémech - takhle jim jejich analýzy jen komplikují řivot, protože přinášejí závěry opačné klíčovám prvkům systému, který RVV zavádí u nás.]

Pro britský Research Excellence Framework (REF) také ve své prezentaci Rosenberg z HEFCE uvádí, že do posuzování kvality vstoupí tři složky:

* Výstupy - kvalita všech typů výzkumu = posuzovaná experty, kteří využijí i bibliometrie.

* Impakt - přínosy ekonomické, společenské, kulturní a kvality života - na bázi popisu, který bude podložen indikátory a příklady.

* Prostředí - kvalita a udržitelnost prostředí, ve kterém je výzkum prováděn - textový popis a indikátory.

Tuzemská RVV se zahrnutím takových jemností nezabývá, přiřazení jednoho bodového hodnocení je pro ni dost. Pokud svou práci dělá RVV aspoň mírně poctivě, nemůže dost dobře o těchto britských závěrech (nebo podobných australských) nevědět. I když v takovém případě by asi nevyzývala kritiky, že mají do konce prázdnin předložit ucelenou představu o tom, jak to dělat jina, než dnes propaguje RVV. Což je ovšem jen důkaz sporem o naprosté nekompetentnosti RVV i její komise pro hodnocení.
22. 06. 2009 | 02:24

Odaha napsal(a):

Problem ceske vedy jsou predevsim lide jako je pan Zlatuska, kteri si z ni udelali dojnou kravu. Kdyz Goldfish nastoupil jako rektor na MU, jedni z jeho prvnich kroku bylo zavedeni vypalneho z grantu. Spickova vyzkumna pracoviste, ktera mela dost penez diky sve schopnosti ziskat granty musela zacit odvadet desatky na rektorat, kde je Zlatuska "moudre" prerozdeloval, predevsim pak smerem ja jeho fakultu informatiky. Tak se stalo, ze lide z jeho klaky meli naraz doma megabitove pripojeni za univerzitni penize a podobne. Tak asi tak. BTW: pana Zlatusku hodnoceni rozlitilo predevsim proto, ze jeho fakulta informatiky, o ktere vyhlasuje jak je svetova, skoncila v hodnoceni vlastne hure nez fakulta socialnich studii. Veda je bohudik oblast, kde nestaci pouze "kecat", ale clovek musi predevsim neco umet. Podivejte se na pane Zlatuskovi publikace na muny.cz a srovnejte napriklad s profesory z katedry genetiky a molekularni biologie. Hned Vam bude jasno...
24. 06. 2009 | 00:08

jirizlatuska napsal(a):

Odaha: Mate to trochu popletene a misty si pletete znamenka, ale jen pro poradek: Po svem nastupu v roce 1998 jsem zavedl pravidla, ktera naopak drivejsi "solidaritu" z penez na vyzkum (pred tim byvalo zvykem dohadovaci rizeni o prerozdelovani v rozpoctu, to uz je daavno minulosti) uplne odbourala, plus kompetitivni mzdovy system, ty veci jsou ostatne ve trech zpravach externich hodnotitelu, ktere MU v dobe meho pusobeni jako rektora posuzovaly. Z rozpoctu fakulty jsem v te dobe nechal plne hradit vyvoj Informacniho systemu, zadne ucelove castky navic tam nebyly (nekteri na fakulte to oznacovali za tunelovani fakulty rektoratem, ale mel jsem na to trochu jiny pohled, kteremu dal dalsi vyvoj zapravdu, i kdyz uz dnes FI sama informacni system cele MU platit samozrejme nemuze). Bodove i jinak vychazi Fakulta informatiky velmi dobre, propocet ukazuje z bodu narust nad 10 mil., v zebricku informatik z HN skoncila FI MU na prvnim miste (http://domaci.ihned.cz/c1-3...), figurujeme v mezinarodnim tymu, ktery se uchazi o KIC v ICT na zrizovanem EIT, atd., Nelecim si zde vlastni bolistky a ani bych si je v obecne kauze nelecil.
24. 06. 2009 | 08:30

J. Jemnický napsal(a):

Jiří Zlatuška:
Naprosto souhlasím s tím, že bodový systém vypracovaný RVV je kontraproduktivní. Velmi jasně vidím, jak vede k nadprodukci podřadných publikací a pseudovýsledků jako například předané metodiky atd. Ale co čeká AV, když prof. Pačes se zabývá různými komisemi a předpokládá gentelmanské jednání. I věda je politikum a jde v ní o peníze. Akademie má velký majetek a ten by se jí dal nějakým lišáckým způsobem odebrat. Věda a školství nikdy žádnou vládu respektive politiky nezajímaly. Podpora vědy to jsou vždy kecy zakrývající, že peněz bude méně. Jasným tahem je rozeštvat AV s universitami, rozděl a panuj. Pokud nepůjdou všichni vědci a pedagogové razantně do demonstrací, tak ať sedí v kanclících a laboratořích a brblají, nakonec na nic jiného se asi nezmohou. Mohou si také ulevit příspěvky k blogum prof. Hořejšího. Studenti jsou také radikální jako koblilhy, tak ať si připravují vlastní budoucnost.
Železničáři a strojvůdci méně blogují a více třískají na kolejnice.

S pozdravem,

J. Jemnický
26. 06. 2009 | 08:47

QQQ napsal(a):

QQQ: Dovoluji si zkopirovat to, co povazuji za nejdulezitejsi z podobne debaty pod clankem V. Horejsiho.

Problem je totiz mnohem obecnejsi, v pravde epistemologicky. Jakkoliv se nam v cesku zda, ze existuje nekolik vyhrocenych nazoru, z hlediska svetoveho se jedna o ponekud zpozdilou diskusi protagonistu ceske narodni vedy. Mimo jine neustala vzajemna podezreni kdo chce komu co ukrast ukazuji na to, jake ma kdo v hodnoceni vlastne cile. Kazdy c... hada podle sve planety.

Ve svetove vede se nutne chysta zasadi zmena chapani vubec samotneho pojmu veda coz je dusledkem bourliveho rozvoje ve sberu a zpracovani dat. Ve zkratce: software neni nejaka podivna polozka R v kafemlejnku, ale jasne vyslovena hypoteza pomoci vcetne navodu na jeji testovani (neoddelitelne). To plati obecne, at ma par SW radku nebo user interface s tancicimi ikonami. Napriklad kazdy pristrojovy software v sobe skryva nazor vyrobce na funkci pristroje. Primarni data tento nazor casto vubec nepotvrzuji, ale kdo se jimi vubec zabyva?

Nasleduje slibena citace :

Prirodovedec: "To je podobne, jako kdyby nejaky aplikacni vedec z oblasti informatiky treba dostal publikace skupiny vedcu zakladniho vyzkumu zadajici o projekt a zacal to projizdet svym puvodnim softwarem na citacni analyzy pomoci teorie grafu (tzv. citacni shluky) na obsah (posuzovani miry shody textu text miningem) aj.

Nasledne by vzal treba klasika Wanga a inspirovan priklady chyb pouzivani statistiky v prirodnich vedach by sjel napr. aktualnost pouzitych statistickych metod (zda nejsou prilis zastarale, zda jsou soubory vzorku dostatecne velke z hlediska asymptotiky pouzitych rozdeleni v testech ...). Neni to prece problem. Potom by se na to pustil nejaky strukturni analyzator textu, ktery by identifikoval logickou strukturu prace atd.

Odborny text zakladniho vyzkumu v nejakem oboru samozrejme muze byt pres oborove uznani pri mezioborovem finacovani hodnocen z hlediska potrebne obecne vedecke exaktnosti.

Metody na tyto rozbory nejen v suflatech jsou a priznam se, ze by to asi nebyla spatna aplikace jako zakazka pro RVV - dostat evropsky projekt na posouzeni urovne zakladniho vyzkumu v CR nejen podle oborovych kriterii ale i podle tech mezioborovych.

Ono k tomu stejne jednou dojde. To je jako geneticke manipulace. V informatice jsou i v CR vyzkumnici, kteri se na to jenom tresou (iz principu, protoze se citi neustale kadrovani ruznymi "metodikami"), sjet digitalizovane databaze odbornych clanku technikami, ktere se zatim vyvijeji spise pro jine ucely a ktere maji skutecne docela slusna jadra z oblasti zakladniho vyzkumu par oboru. Jsou to takovi budouci vedecti hackeri. Vim, ze pri diskusich v hospodach maji chut udelat tu rano a hodit celou tu soucasnou deformovanou oblast scientometrie nejen obrazne i skutecne pod stul. :) A ti nadsenejsi hltaji naznaky prof. Z., co by se mozna melo. Prece jen fandi :). Koneckoncu na MU Brnaci uz maji ruzne programky. :)

Mozna to je nejen aplikace, ale dokonce zakladni vyzkum zabyvajici se zakladnim vyzkumem? :)"

QQQ: Ono totiz k tomuto jevu dochazi a je to nejspis jedina a moznost jak vratit do vyzkumu hypotezy. Dochazi k tomu proto, ze je to technicky mozne, diky zrychlovani vypocetni techniky. Clanky na toto tema zaslane v roce 2005 mely dva roky zpozdeni, dnes jsou venku za pet-sest mesicu (napr. Bergeron et al. Nat. Methods June 2009).

A Cesko (ale i jine mensi zeme) je, podle mne, dobre pripraveno, protoze nemeli tolik penez a tak nad vysledky vic premysleli a psali softwary. Ano, jsou to ty opovrhovane polozky typu R v kafemlejnku, v Plzni, Brne, Liberci, na UTIA a UI, MFF, FJFI i v jiznich Cechach jich peknych par vzniklo.
26. 06. 2009 | 10:30

Alenka napsal(a):

K poslednímu odstavci QQQ soudím, že autoři neměli na mysli netriviální experimentální sw, který na amerických univerzitách uznávaj� jako výsledek pro tenure a povýšení, a analogii citací se tam myslí velikost skupiny užívat kteří ho dál používají v akademickém prostředí, modifikují nebo se třeba na metody jeho vývoje odkazuji dál. Oba autoři mají s programováním a programovými systémy zkušenosti, takže bych je z apriorního odporu k programům nepodezírala.
Co se ale množí jako houby po dešti, je vykazování jednoduchých studentských programu do RIV. To metodika přímo podporuje a povzbuzuje k tomu.
V tom "vypořádání připomínek" k metodice, které mi uváděl 20.6. v 08:52 v odkazu prof. Z., je nejhorší to, jak pan Blažka i celá Rada vlády odmítají uznat, že je problém, když nejsou schopni nijak vykazovaná data ověřit. Odpovídají tam, že se ze zákona musí vykazovat jen správné údaje. Vždyť to je úplná parodie! Považme, že by Ministerstvo financí zrušilo veškeré kontroly v daňové oblasti, protože všichni mají že zákona povinnost daňové přiznání vyplnit podle skutečnosti. Výběr daní by zkolaboval stejně rychle, jako teď kolabuje příprava rozpočtu pro AV.
26. 06. 2009 | 20:38

QQQ napsal(a):

Ad software: 1) Jadro problemu spociva ve vedecke (spise odborne) poctivosti. I spousta publikaci je trivialnich nebo vylozene nespravnych, rada (myslim tak 75%) technicky spravnych publikaci je rutinnich a to i casopisech typu J. Biol. Chem. nebo J. Phys. Chem.. Software alespon funguje nebo nefunguje na velkou tridu dat a to se da overit. Casto se jeho pomoci ukaze, ze velka trida dat je spatne interpretovana. A teprve pak ma smysl - je z hlediska epistemologie pripustne - navrhnout novou hypotezu.
Ad overovani: 2) I financni urad kontroluje jen namatkou. V zakone i v kafemlejnku je, ze za podvod se pri vykazovani vysledku bude trest. Danove priznani si taky kazdy dava sam a vykazuje tam, co je pri kontrole schopen dokazat. Tak se nekdy naklady vynakladne pri praci pro firmu vykazat nedaji - treba nemam uctenku nebo jsem o dovolene potkal duleziteho obchodniho partnera a uzavrej s nim kontrakt - a naopak kdyz jdu o sluzebni ceste nakupovat vanocni darky, nikdo neni schopen to zjistit a FU to nerikam.
Ve vztahu k 1) software proste funguje nebo nefunguje, data v clanku jiste nikdo na miste kontrolovat nebude. Pro mne je software, byt jednoduchy, kontrolovatelnejsi a pro poznani sveta casto prinosnejsi, nez clanky v casopisech FOTTEA a PRESLIA, ale i nektere treba v J. Chem. Phys. Nektera pracoviste AV dnes pomalu v nicem jinem nez v casopisech vydavanych v CR (FOTTEA, PRESLIA, FOLIA PARASITOL. apod.) nepublikuji.
3)Parodie na vedu i na vysoke skoly je predevsim stav, kdy se tam zivi 1000x vic lidi nez v dobe, kdy vznikala soucasna ucebnicova fyzika, chemie apod. Ti lide patri do muzeji, za katedry strednich skol, do vyvojovych dilen apod. Uroven vecne debaty na techto forech tomu odpovida, zcela mimo podstatu veci, diskutuji se jednotlive "technicalities", IF se nezpochybnuje i kdyz i v molekularni biologii a biochemii uplne nesmyslne preferuje popularni a kratkodeche clanky, na ostatni discipliny se nehodi vubec.
Z tohoto stavu neni rychla cesta ven, predevsim ne v CR, kde prumerna kvalita je na 20% svetove. Neni nikdo, kdo by pravidelne rikal pravdu a mel autoritu byt slysen. Osobne si ze sve prace nejvic vazim softwaru - a taky, kdyz je nekde ukazuji, sklizeji uznani - a prumyslovych spolupraci, protoze tam je kontrola praxi. Publikaci moc nemam taky proto, ze se v nich snazim ukazat netrivialni veci a revieweri se v nich vetsinou nevyznaji, takze je s nimi moc prace. Vedlejsi kolega sype rutinni clanky z rukavu a ma jich 40 do roka. V casopisech s lehce nadprumernym IF v oboru, coz je pro ceske vedce meta nejvyssi.
27. 06. 2009 | 04:09

David Kalhous napsal(a):

Hm, oproti předchozí debatě pod textem prof. Hořejšího je zde mrtvo. Ostatně jaké se připravují jiné kroky, než psaní blogu, ptá se již spíše jen zvědavý externista?
27. 06. 2009 | 17:11

QQQ napsal(a):

Kdo by je jako mel pripravovat a qui bono?
Zajmy jsou na cele skale a kazdy (no, mozna naprosta vetsina) ma nejakeho kamarada kteremu je zavazan ktery v poslednich letech vykazal jen par clanku ve Folia Parasitologica nebo Photosynthetica. Casto, dokonce vesmes, tito lide skutecne administrativne a technicky drzi cele ustavy, panely grantovych agentur apod. Kdo pracuje musi mit cas pipetovat, jezdit po cizine a administrativu rad prenecha. Tak co s tim. Cela akademie ved se ted nerekokurzuje a jak by to dopadlo jsme v od 90. let 20. stoleti videli v nekolika kolech. Proste ceska veda zustane ceska se vsim, co k tomu patri.
Navic - a to se nerika - reforma nejvic dopadla na vysokoskolske vyzkumne ustavy a ruzne jednotlivce, kteri se na VS zivili jen vedou a vyzkumem. Tam se reze (v zakladnim vyzkumu) tesne pod prumerem impakt faktoru jednotlivych oboru, na AV postaci 2-3 clanky v dolnich 20%. Duvodem je to, ze na VS byly vyzkumne zamery de-facto granty vcetne spotreby zatimco na AV pouze platy a rezie. Takze nakonec se na AV par duchodcu propusti, tu a a tam nejake vedlejsi pracoviste zavre, par mladych zase odejde do ciziny a za pet let si zas zvesela zablogujeme.
27. 06. 2009 | 17:29

Alenka napsal(a):

Nejsem v tom žádný expert, ale když jsem si četla odkaz z článku prof. Z.+Z. (jak to psát, když mají na profesoři inicialu stejnou, snad "prof. Z's"? :) z Velké Británie, připadá mi poslední odstavec QQQ ve shodě s "posoudit výsledky musí v prvé řadě experti v peer review a posuzovat se musí jen malé vybrané vzorky, aby to bylo kvalitně zvládnutelné, protože jinak se ztratí stromy v lese". Nebo je to ještě nějak jinak?
27. 06. 2009 | 17:34

QQQ napsal(a):

Jinak to nejde.
Ale v zasade to znamena kazdy rok zrusit nejake profesorske misto a jine zase centralne vygenerovat. Tak to delaji treba ve Svedsku. A pekne peer review se presvedci jak to prvnich par let novy pan profesor dela, pak uz ho nechaji, protoze je jasno, ze nikdo nedokaze sprintovat vecne a ani to vede uplne neprospiva.
Max Planckova spolecnost rusi nebo zasadne restrukturalizuje (s novym reditelem) a generuje cele ustavy, ktere jsou, mimochodem, proti nasim AV mnohdy docela male.
Rakousko dokonce zridilo ISTA novym zakonem MIMO stavajici system univerzit i tamni AV, protoze neverili, ze uvnitr se da skutecna kvalita dosahnout. A to je treba Videnska univerzita proti kterekoliv nasi o parnik napred, maji tam ruzne nezavisle Boltzmannovy laboratore, MFPL nebo IMP.
27. 06. 2009 | 17:50

Alenka napsal(a):

To bych viděla jako rozumné slovo, děkuji. Jen se mi zdá, že se toho reforma, kterou kritizují prof. Z.+Z., nedotkla ani omylem. To si ani od nejbližších sousedů neumíme vzít příklad?
27. 06. 2009 | 18:32

QQQ napsal(a):

My to v podstate nechceme, tedy alespon AV a cast reprezentace VS. My chceme svou ceskou vedu s Photosynteticou, Presliou a Fotteou, domacimi komisemi, kazdodenni kavickou, nic neresicimi schuzemi a rozhodovanim na posledni chvili po znamostech. Svetova veda z ceskych zemi odesla s poslednim zidovskym profesorem nemecke univerzity nekdy v roce 1940.
Jinak ale soucasna reforma financovani vedy je na VS zarez pekne vysoko, mnohem vyse nez na AV. A protoze veda na VS neni hlavni cinnost a VS jsou autonomni, reze se pomerne bez zabran, adresne a osobne. Odtud Zrzaveho reci o neefektivite AV a o tom, ze vime, kde je ta kvalita. Navic na VS mam peer review s kazdym novym chytrym studentem, treba i bakalarem. Cemuz se lze na AV snadno vyhnout.
Takze je sance, ze za par let se to ukaze, ostatne ledacos se uz ukazalo, nejlepsi VS pracoviste jsou mnohem bliz nejlepsim pracovistim AV nez by stejny kafemlejnek ukazal pred peti-seti lety. Odtud predevsim Horejsiho odstoupeni z kafemlejnkovaci komise. Zacalo se ukazovat, ze mu to nebude tak sypat, jak si byli s Konvalinkou leta jisti.
Neni vsechno prirodoveda UK, s tou se lehce meri, na tu se snadno vytahuje. Vyznamne je treba, ze jediny u nas ERC grant dostala VSCHT. Na AV snad nikdo vyznamny ani neaplikoval a kdo aplikoval, dostal na ....
Takze mozna, ze pomerne brzo se ledacos ukaze a nebude to, nejspis, na AV.
27. 06. 2009 | 20:36

Michal Hocek napsal(a):

to QQQ
Mate hodne zastarale informace. ERC grant (starting grant pro mlade do 8 let od PhD) na VSCHT dostal Doc. Stepanek, ktery aplikoval jeste z Anglie. Jinak v Advanced kategorii ho letos dostali prof. Michl a dr. Schroeder (oba UOCHB AV CR) jako jedini ze stredni a vychodni Evropy. Jinak rada dalsich aplikaci z UOCHB byla v ERC hodne vysoko hodnocena (tesne pod carou) - a tesne nedostat grant v takoveto soutezi, kde se dava treba jen 10-15 grantu na celou chemii v cele Evrope neni tak uplne "dostat na ...." Kolik lidi aplikovalo z jinych ustavu nevim, ale UOCHB s 2 Advanced ERC granty byl jednou z nejuspesnejcih evropskych instituci...
28. 06. 2009 | 16:04

QQQ napsal(a):

Omlouvam se za chybu, ale neodpustim si rypanec: Michl je ten emeritus z Boulderu a Schroeder to dostal na zaklade vysledku z Nemecka na jejichz zaklade byl na UOCHB prijat ne? Jednak to nejsou moc odchovanci ceskych instituci a za druhe nikde jinde nic.

Samozrejme mam radost ze UOCHB dosahl tohoto vysledku a je jasne, ze UOCHB je jednim z tech 5(?) ustavu, kde se deje, co by se dit melo. Ovsem nikde jinde do te miry a ani UOCHB by se do uplne rekonkurzace nemohl pustit bez backupu prumyslovych penez. Z domacich zdroju to nejde, ty se strasne pliznou a rozdeluji po kamaradech.

Hospodarska komora by mela pravdu (s redukci AV na elity) kdyby vedle A rekla i B, kdyz predvedete potencilani nobelisty, my jim dame Nobelovskou vyplatu. Ovsem i vyse zminene spis ilustruje, ze ceskym akademickym procesum lze spis neverit.

Takze se muze stat - a mozna je to jedina nadeje - ze spicky prumyslu reknou my dame 30% a od statu vezmeme 70% a ohlidame si, ze dostaneme Cechy s nejlepsi referenci z PhD z MIT a postdokem z Berkeley. Tak jako UOCHB dostal Schroedera. Neni totiz pravda, ze v prumyslu nikdo nechape smysl zakladniho vyzkumu. Urcite to chapou v prumeru lip nez politici. Oni jen opravnene neveri Ceskemu zakladnimu vyzkumu, respektive zpusobu rozdelovani penez v nem. Taky v prumyslu nikomu nevadi platit 80 tis. mesicne, to tam maji spravci siti i vedouci vyzkumu. O cemz si cesky profesor nebo vedouci tymu muze nechat akorat zdat.
28. 06. 2009 | 18:53

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Rozdíl proti Pavlovi je v tom, že on pronásledování křesťanů prováděl před svým setkáním se vzkříšeným Kristem, tedy ve svém předkřesťanském období. Kdyby se takto choval po svém obrácení, nebyl by hoden našeho obdivu.
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Takze je sance, ze za par let se to ukaze, ostatne ledacos se uz ukazalo, nejlepsi VS pracoviste jsou mnohem bliz nejlepsim pracovistim AV nez by stejny kafemlejnek ukazal pred peti-seti lety. Odtud predevsim Horejsiho odstoupeni z kafemlejnkovaci komise. Zacalo se ukazovat, ze mu to nebude tak sypat, jak si byli s Konvalinkou leta jisti
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Navic - a to se nerika - reforma nejvic dopadla na vysokoskolske vyzkumne ustavy a ruzne jednotlivce, kteri se na VS zivili jen vedou a vyzkumem
09. 12. 2009 | 22:35

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